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‘Average’ 3.5 yo skills


Daffy2016

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Just trying to put together some of the puzzle that is 3.5 yo DD and where she sits in terms of what kids her age should be doing.


She’s not great at getting herself dressed but can fetch food and drink as needed - water from the tap or snacks from the shelf or fridge. Toilet training not going well and has accidents most days.


Knows all colours, can count to 20, do basic addition and subtraction using her fingers. Can identify numbers up to 11. Can identify probably half of the letters of the alphabet, identify her name and mummy and daddy. Can write one or two letters, and had a reasonable go at her name the other day. Can identify some phonics sounds (d for dog, t for tree etc).


Her language use is quite sophisticated and she loves words, with ‘intriguing’ being the current favourite. Can also retain explanations and explain them back, with weather and the human body main areas of interest - like what makes a thunderstorm and why we get sick.


We’re in the process of seeking some support for her behaviour and I’m wondering how she compares to the average 3.5 year old. Daycare is little to no help on this front and I don’t know many kids her age.

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Seayork2002

Sounds about what ds was doing at that age I guess but I really can't remember what he did when he just did things in his own time

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[mention]DaLittleEd[/mention] she has very big feelings, every request is met with screams or yelling, or she ignores us completely. She refuses to use the toilet so it’s a massive battle. It’s not so much the behaviour as the intensity of it - she literally never stops. It’s not making for a very happy household so we’re trying to get some support.


Both grandparents (previously involved in education) have said she’s bright and probably bored, but I don’t know that’s the case.

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Crazyone4532

@DaLittleEd she has very big feelings, every request is met with screams or yelling, or she ignores us completely. She refuses to use the toilet so it’s a massive battle. It’s not so much the behaviour as the intensity of it - she literally never stops. It’s not making for a very happy household so we’re trying to get some support.


Both grandparents (previously involved in education) have said she’s bright and probably bored, but I don’t know that’s the case.

 

I don’t have a 3.5 year old but I teach Kindergarten (First year of school in NSW) so 5 and 6 year olds. About half my class can only identify numbers to 11 ish and some don’t know more than 4 or 5 letters/sounds despite being at school for a whole 10 weeks. So I’d say your DD is probably quite bright and maybe the grandparents are onto something.

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A mother's instinct is powerful, so if you are concerned have a developmental or behavioural paed look at her initially.


I had a very bright toddler and pre-schooler and ended up having her developmental progress tested and was in retrospect fobbed off with "she's super bright and just bored out of her brains." Whilst that was somewhat true it wasn't the whole truth and I feel guilty I didn't really meet my daughter's needs until much much later. We didn't have the big behaviours though.

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A mother's instinct is powerful, so if you are concerned have a developmental or behavioural paed look at her initially.


I had a very bright toddler and pre-schooler and ended up having her developmental progress tested and was in retrospect fobbed off with "she's super bright and just bored out of her brains." Whilst that was somewhat true it wasn't the whole truth and I feel guilty I didn't really meet my daughter's needs until much much later. We didn't have the big behaviours though.

 

This is what I’m being told at the moment and I do think there’s some truth to it but not the whole picture. Do you mind if I ask what else you would have done in hindsight?

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Sounds pretty typical. Especially the big emotions. Is she due for a MCHN visit shortly? They will do an assessment and offer any advice. You can also speak to your GP too.


Probably her vocabulary and comprehension are more developed.


If she goes to Kinder, the teacher should be able to offer advice and support too.


FWIW when my boy was 3.5 he was only just learning to use the potty,pooed in nappies until 4, would converse quite intelligently, knew many numbers/letters, refuse to dress himself but was quite helpful. But he was quite immature emotionally. He did 2 years of 3yo kinder and started school at 5 turning 6, and is thriving.



He is now 8 and in grade 2.

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[mention]Daffy2016[/mention] my daughter was later diagnosed with ADD but not officially until she was in the later years of secondary school. She flew under the radar somewhat in that she was a relatively high achieving, very well behaved child. Her two younger brothers were both born with issues and needed hospitalisations and surgeries in their early weeks and I spent their early years consumed with their needs, especially the youngest who had global developmental delays, later diagnosed as ASD.


I wish I'd pursued a paed appointment for her. She had issues at school with attention but at the same time was completing work 2 years ahead of her peers, especially in literacy. As school progressed she was a good student, but that early spark had disappeared and she was even struggling in some areas. I did have a paed look at her when she was about 11 but when life is complicated with the demands of a younger brother with a disability it's easy to have that as the reason she was stressing and had plateaued.


Eventually we had another paed appoint for her in later secondary and she did a trial of medication. Her academic scores improved 30% in 4 weeks and she was much happier.


I should have stood my ground when she was little and kept pushing for help for her, but we are all products of the environment we are in and to be honest I was struggling just to keep my head above water during those years.


My daughter is now an adult, not on any medication, working full time and studying at night to complete a course (should be finished this year). She's an amazingly beautiful, kind, smart and interesting person, so we must have done something right. :)

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She sounds similar to my 5yo (only toilet trained at 4), who has been diagnosed with ASD. But we also have very rigid routines, repetitive behaviours, anxiety, sensory stuff and meltdowns.


So hard for me to say what is standard in terms of behaviour. But the big things would be meltdowns and repetitive behaviours if you are concerned about ASD.


Can't hurt to see a dev paed or a psych or similar.

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Oh and with the toilet training. I would ease back on pressure and put her in nappies. Then kind of lead her to the idea for eg take her to shops and just happen to walk past an ilundie display "oh pity you don't need undies, those ones are so pretty". And get something as a bribe but don't force it. Just let her know that when the toilet starts happening, she will get whatever. We used a trampoline (yep, we had to go big), and told her when she started trying the loo she would get the trampoline. Then we just waited with the odd dropping of trampolines in conversation. We really need to convince DD that things are her idea...

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Fruitmincepies

Daffy (I’m sure I’ve said before) she sounds a lot like my DD (who is now almost 7). School last year was a bit of a disaster for her, so we saw a psych and did some testing. She’s possibly ADHD, and her IQ on the high side (but nothing extraordinary) and her verbal skills in the top 2%. She had a lot of issues with toilet training, and lots with emotional regulation. Anyway, this year she’s doing so well and is able to concentrate in class and regulate her emotions so much better.


My 3.5yo DS is so different. He can recognise one letter, and his knowledge of colours is dubious (DD knew hers by 18mo). He can do basic counting. But he’s also obviously quite bright, just in a much more straightforward way than DD was.

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DD didn't toilet train till about 3.5, She just showed no interest. But when we started she got it in 2 days(few accidents the first day, then none. She's never wet the bed once). She knew her colours, and letters, some numbers but I don't recall her being able to add or subtract. She had speech therapy for 2 years from about 2.5 till 4 or so.


She's never had a tantrum or screamed at me like your DD does. She's never been one to be described as having 'big emotions" which to be honest I found bloody weird after all the talk of tantrums people bombard new parents with! She did stomp her foot at me once lol.

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I will add, you might be on the money with being bright. I am somewhat convinced my DD is bright (but not sure if it's just because that's what parents think!) but also hard to pull apart from the ASD. So for example, she appears to be able to do simple addition, subtraction and multiplication in her head, but I don't if that's because she is bright or because she is so visually oriented that she can actually picture it in her mind and count it (if that makes any sense).

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Her physical development certainly sounds to be within typical ranges.


The cognitive skills/language development she is displaying sound to be above a typical 3.5 year old. Often bright kids have big feelings. Ours does. He also has processing speed/anxiety issues.


It would be worth mentioning it to whoever you are seeking help with. Perfectionism/anxiety can often manifest as emotion regulation difficulties.

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She sounds very very similar to our DD who has just turned four. I find it extremely difficult to know what is normal and when it's beyond normal in terms of how intense and unenjoyable it is. I have kind of let it go as she's an angel at childcare and just tried to be as consistent as possible and calm as possible at home, but I think the biggest issue is that I just don't have much support other than childcare while I'm working full time. I feel so guilty saying that I despair on weekends because it's so exhausting and full on. DH is a whole nother set of worries so I suspect I'm basically just at the end of my tether most of the time and therefore find it extremely difficult.


I'll keep an eye on it over the next year or two as we've decided to send her to school at 5 turning 6 and I want to see if she calms down or not.

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I have a 3.5yo who is reasonably bright, but certainly not gifted in any way, and your DD sounds slightly more advanced than him (although I think girls often are?). He can almost count to 20 (mixes up 13-15), knows a few numbers and letters by sight (but fairly inconsistently), can write one letter (the first letter of his name), can’t do any addition or subtraction. His language has always been quite good (and he is bilingual which apparently slows them down a bit, although we haven’t noticed that), but I doubt he knows intriguing!


She sounds quite bright but also within the realm of ‘normal’ to me. My DS toilet trained just before 3 but there are a couple of kids in my mothers group who still haven’t so I don’t think that’s super unusual.

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Spidey_Senses

She is probably 'behind the average' in toilet training but thats not something you can force. Id just keep trying with lots of praise. Make sure she is drinking enough water and is not constipated and keep it fun and not stressful.


Otherwise she sounds like she is doing pretty well with letters and learning. Its not expected of kids that they be able to write at that age.


It sounds like she is also going fine with attempting to dress herself, getting a drink etc. Its normal for a child that age to need some help with things like doing shoes, pouring drink etc.

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ClaudiaCosette

She sounds a lot like my DD1 (who is now 7). She's pretty bright (very good at maths, especially) but has those big emotions. She's getting a bit better now with it but will still have some meltdowns over things that aren't really important.


Toilet training is so variable! My DS was 4 before he was reliably toilet trained, and DD was probably 3.5 but I can't really remember. I was pretty relaxed about it and just let them do it at their own pace. They got there eventually (kindy helped a lot, seeing the other kids going to the toilet). But DS still wasn't dry at night until nearly 6.


I think your DD sounds quite bright in her knowledge and also with her motor skills. I don't think either of my older kids was able to write letters or their name before they were 4.

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Bit off topic and sorry to derail but for kids who seem bright, do you need to do anything extra to get them tested etc? We have had many people commenting lately that DD is quite bright at 2.5. Daycare have recognised it so are supporting her as she has started learning to write letters and has an excellent vocabulary and pronunciation but it wasn't really on my radar as it's just her... But now I'm wondering if I need to do anything to say if she is in a normal range?


She can do most of the OP's list, can dress herself incl identifying correct foot for shoes, TT just before 2, pours her own milk & cereal, recognises her name...

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She sounds a lot like DD at that age too. DD had the big emotions to go along with her stubbornness. We ended up seeking help when DD was 4 at our paed's suggestion. Things that helped regulate the big emotions was prewarning DD when plans might change and giving her the choice of two acceptable options instead of forcing one particular choice on her. Also making her aware of her emotions and where she fells them in her body helped her know how she was feeling. You might feel something in your belly when your happy, sad, nervous or angry but they all are different feelings in the belly. You might fist your hands when angry, but clap your hands when your happy. We were impressed at how much more DD could regulate herself when she started noticing her body's reactions and what they meant.


Unfortunately the big emotions don't disappear as they grow, but they get better at managing them with help.

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Kiwi Bicycle

Bit off topic and sorry to derail but for kids who seem bright, do you need to do anything extra to get them tested etc? We have had many people commenting lately that DD is quite bright at 2.5. Daycare have recognised it so are supporting her as she has started learning to write letters and has an excellent vocabulary and pronunciation but it wasn't really on my radar as it's just her... But now I'm wondering if I need to do anything to say if she is in a normal range?


She can do most of the OP's list, can dress herself incl identifying correct foot for shoes, TT just before 2, pours her own milk & cereal, recognises her name...

 

You need to have a child physch do WISC ( IQ) testing. They tend to want to do it when the child is older ( school age). However this was testing for developmental issues, not being bright. It's expensive ( around $750 privately, lower if you can get a slot at a university clinic). It's probably worth waiting until she's school age.

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You need to have a child physch do WISC ( IQ) testing. They tend to want to do it when the child is older ( school age). However this was testing for developmental issues, not being bright. It's expensive ( around $750 privately, lower if you can get a slot at a university clinic). It's probably worth waiting until she's school age.

 

Thankyou, in that case we will just continue letting her do what she wants and see how she progresses. Just wanted to make sure I wasn't missing something!

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